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Jedi

Logs system of all our trades/transfers

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25 minutes ago, SlOom said:

 

If he hated this, why have activated the command? (I do not think she was turned on by default)

If the message bothered him, he just had to disable and not ask admins to remove the packet. (Coincidentally, the admins have done without pressure.)

 

@Elie : To be honest, i don't care about ticket. Tickets are here when you are locked out/scammed/lost your auth code etc.. not for asking a logs. And what about if someone has access to my account and i would like to see my logs without asking on ticket ? :) The guy is going to write on a paper what he did on my account and gonna give me it? Something "automatic" is more cool than write every trade/transfers we do on xat.

 

You're right in that that's what the majority of the tickets are about, but you're wrong in thinking a security question regarding transactions is not useful. When trying to verify identities of certain individuals who have been locked out, or lost their authentication codes, sometimes you need to get creative to do so. That's where questions like these come in to place because it does go a long way in deciding whether or not the person on the ticket is the rightful owner.

 

Sure this could be beneficial, but we also need to take in to consideration the effects this may have on everything else. 

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5 minutes ago, Nick said:

 

You're right in that that's what the majority of the tickets are about, but you're wrong in thinking a security question regarding transactions aren't useful. When trying to verify identities of certain individuals who have been locked out, or lost their authentication codes, sometimes you need to get creative to do so. That's where questions like these come in to place because it does go a long way in deciding whether or not the person on the ticket is the rightful owner.

 

Sure this could be beneficial, but we also need to take in to consideration the effects this may have on everything else. 

 

Something you and volunteers DON'T understand :

 

What's useful about asking for transations ? Nothing. (Oh numbers and powers!!!)

Before we could easily see transfers from a xat packet but since it was removed, we can't anymore. Tell me what's related to security ? Nothing again.

 

If it was a security question, why xat added it before from xat packets ?

 

Showing logs of transfers/trade is nothing if it doesn't show personal user informations. (IP/password etc...)

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Just now, SlOom said:

 

Something you and volunteers DON'T understand :

 

What's useful about asking for transations ? Nothing. (Oh numbers and powers!!!)

Before we could easily see transfers from a xat packet but since it was removed, we can't anymore. Tell me what's related to security ? Nothing again.

Showing logs of transfers/trade is nothing if it doesn't show personal user informations. (IP/password etc...)

You clearly aren't getting the point, but that's okay.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Nick said:

You clearly aren't getting the point, but that's okay.

 

 

 

The point of what ? The SECURITY QUESTION ???? But why xat added it before if it's supposed to be security question ? Explain me this.

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1 minute ago, SlOom said:

 

The point of what ? The SECURITY QUESTION ???? But why xat added it before if it's supposed to be security question ? Explain me this.

 

They had it before because they were unaware of how it could have and was abused. Knowing your trade history and recent transactions is something only you should know, which is why it's asked a lot on tickets to verify certain people's identities. If someone got access to this information along with some other basic knowledge about said person, then we could really run in to some issues with account security. 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Nick said:

 

They had it before because they were unaware of how it could have and was abused. Knowing your trade history and recent transactions is something only you should know, which is why it's asked a lot on tickets to verify certain people's identities. If someone got access to this information along with some other basic knowledge about said person, then we could really run in to some issues with account security. 

 

 

 

"Unaware" isn't the word. You can easily run Wireshark (or another software) and see/save logs so there are still nothing related to security and it was removed because someone asked for it. (Techrax) :) 

 

For your second point, what about if someone has access to the account, made a ticket and ask for transations logs  (Since he has your password)? "What's your last trade/transfers" he said his last trade/transfers with my account, and vols (without problems) tells him what he wants. What's again related to security ? Nothing because there ARE not security.

 

Someone who has the same FAI can do the same things than the owner of the account like made a ticket, send xat/days, do trade etc.. (No security again). (Like if it was his account)

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Well, i'd like to see it,

 

but i remember that i've opened some tickets in the past, like to to get my email changed and also some other stuff and they also wanted to know what powers i purchased from store and trade/transfer, i just think its just another security related question to make sure its you and not a potential hacker, the hacker likely wouldn't know what trades and transfers you did. Just in case the hacker is aware of most of your data and is logged in with your account. However, that doesn't mean, there can not be other similar security related stuff to ask. Controversial.

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Just now, LaFleur said:

Just in case the hacker is aware of most of your data and is logged in with your account. However, that doesn't mean there can not be other similar security related stuff to ask. Controversial.

Whether or not that's true, they already have access to the account and therefore doesn't provide any argument for "transfer logs will cause accounts to be hacked via lost access in ticket" which is nonsense, really. And if they do get access I bet could care less about your transfers in the past; they want all the xats and days and powers in your account, not your transfer history.

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14 minutes ago, Stah said:

Whether or not that's true, they already have access to the account and therefore doesn't provide any argument for "transfer logs will cause accounts to be hacked via lost access in ticket" which is nonsense, really. And if they do get access I bet could care less about your transfers in the past; they want all the xats and days and powers in your account, not your transfer history.

You can get a lot of information just by being logged in, even some information most don't know.

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3 minutes ago, Elie said:

You can get a lot of information just by being logged in, even some information most don't know.

So how is this a reason to put down this idea? It's not going to help a phisher gain access at all, and the only change being that if they do gain access they can view past trades? How's that relevant? If they try and regain access later then surely you don't ask questions based on the (possibly) stolen logs.

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4 minutes ago, Stah said:

If they try and regain access later then surely you don't ask questions based on the (possibly) stolen logs.

I don't want to lose being able to ask the question.

 

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No one puts down the idea.

Volunteers (and past ones) are just saying this will be harder for them to get the point of who is making the ticket and if the user is "trustable" and should be helped.

Therefore, multiplying questions if a way to check if the user is coherent, if he has a clear idea of what happened on his account the past few months.

 

The real question is, do traders really need this tool? Using an excell file is as cool as having a tool (:() and this is a way lot easier to update it, to make statistics about it.

 

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2 hours ago, Elie said:

This tells me you don't know much about tickets, which is expected I guess.

 

Anyway, how hard can it be to track your own trades and transfers? You can do it with a paper and pencil. I'm sure you can write something to make it easier.

this is like the 4th or 5th time me saying this.

WHY DOES THERE ALWAYS HAVE TO BE EXTRA STEPS TO DO SOMETHING SIMPLE ON XAT?
yes im angry because everyone on xat now has this mentality which is sickening

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46 minutes ago, Sydno said:

The real question is, do traders really need this tool? Using an excell file is as cool as having a tool (:() and this is a way lot easier to update it, to make statistics about it.

Manual > automatic?

 

Just wow.

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1 hour ago, Sydno said:

The real question is, do traders really need this tool? Using an excell file is as cool as having a tool (:() and this is a way lot easier to update it, to make statistics about it.

 

 

There are not only traders on Xat. (scn)

 

I don't think using an excell file is very useful and faster when the thing can be done automatically. (E.g : Events.)

On xat, we need only to note manually  "password", "email", "auth code" and not the actions we do on XAT, that side is xat which manages to do what we want. (logs)

 

Getting back on the idea of Jedi, it is good and it would be pretty cool to have a look at the transfers and trade instead (again) to do a ticket for a simple question. If you do not want someone who does not own the account and that should not see the logs, just add something like "second step" or "protection on/off" on login like Jedi said and the problem is solved.

 

You try to complicate things and bring you to the work of volunteers (then they have had enough :) )  so that it can be done automatically as events.

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I actually think Excell is a lot more automatic than any tool xat can made when it's about doing statistics.

Yet, maybe that's easier to make statistics than inputting data.

 

 

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10 hours ago, Jedi said:

I would like a list of all our trades/transfers. e.g events system.

 

It would be much easier for traders or users who trade/transfer a lot to have a history of their trades/transfers.

 

What do you think about this suggestion?

Yup  i like that .  Example yesterday some friend send wrong some xats to somone .. But the problem is TO WHOM ?  Now he open ticket for his last transfers , if that is possible . ..  thereby

I support it :p   

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1 minute ago, Sydno said:

I actually think Excell is a lot more automatic than any tool xat can made when it's about doing statistics.

Yet, maybe that's easier to make statistics than inputting data.

 

 

 

We're talking about something that will "show" logs, not on making statistics. (According to Jedi's idea.)

 

If statistics needs to be here, it can be done with a google tool (E.g: Eventstats)

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I was according a lot of importance on statistics because of the importance of the purpose trading in checking logs.

Most of time, you may check transfer logs because you want to see your profit, comparing the price you bought something and the price you sold it.

I was also thinking of bot hosters, who maybe need to have a global sight of their bot(s) transfers. Once again, having statistics could be useful to optimize users experience and to fill the current demand (of days for example).

 

Either way, that's only when you did a wrong transfer. As Marya said. Making a ticket for that is a pain for sure, but if it's only the case of few users, I guess it's fine.

Therefore, only volunteers can have a precise idea of how often this is happening.

 

EDIT: If you have precise other examples, do not hesitate to add it to the debate.

 

To put it in a nutshell, I think this is a good idea that does not help more users than it is annoying others.

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22 minutes ago, SlOom said:

Getting back on the idea of Jedi, it is good and it would be pretty cool to have a look at the transfers and trade instead (again) to do a ticket for a simple question. If you do not want someone who does not own the account and that should not see the logs, just add something like "second step" or "protection on/off" on login like Jedi said and the problem is solved.

Lmao why is everyone obsessed with adding on and off buttons on the login page... what's stopping them from turning it on? OH! Let's make them put 50 codes in somewhere. No. If someone gets into your account they don't give a flying monkey about your transfer history. They're going to steal your powers and then bounce. Simple as.

 

We want this because, well firstly, it's information that should really be available anyways. We personally made the transfers ourselves, so I don't see the big issue. Secondly, is the valuable information you could get out of these statistics. Things like:

  • xats given
  • xats recieved
  • xats
  • Possible profits you could have made (i.e. check the prices you traded at the time compared to fairtrade now)
  • On average how much you make per trade
  • How much profit you're making compared to a few months ago
  • And of course, who received what (maybe you're looking to make another deal with a trader, but forgot their name?)

Plus a lot more that I just haven't thought of yet. You might say "so it's only useful for traders" well, not really. We could all utilize this information and take some interest in it whether or not we are actively looking for profit or not.

 

8 minutes ago, Sydno said:

does not help more users than it is annoying others

 

Oh Jesus Christ, how does this annoy anyone? Just because the volunteers (who obviously matter more than the community who wants something) are going to lose their question on one department? (This question can still be used on lost access, due to the fact they cant access the log at that time, unless it was saved)

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8 minutes ago, Stah said:

Lmao why is everyone obsessed with adding on and off buttons on the login page... what's stopping them from turning it on? OH! Let's make them put 50 codes in somewhere. No. If someone gets into your account they don't give a flying monkey about your transfer history. They're going to steal your powers and then bounce. Simple as.

 

We want this, well firstly, it's information that should really be available anyways. We personally made the transfers ourselves, so I don't see the big issue. Secondly, is the valuable information you could get out of these statistics. Things like:

  • xats given
  • xats recieved
  • xats
  • Possible profits you could have made (i.e. check the prices you traded at the time compared to fairtrade now)
  • On average how much you make per trade
  • How much profit you're making compared to a few months ago
  • And of course, who received what (maybe you're looking to make another deal with a trader, but forgot their name?)

Plus a lot more that I just haven't thought of yet. You might say "so it's only useful for traders" well, not really. We could all utilize this information and take some interest in it whether or not we are actively looking for profit or not.

 

Already why the accounts are easily accessible? Xat look not only IP address but also the ISP. (If i'm not wrong) For example, my parents both have the same ISP and I can connect without problems.

If Xat would look only IP, access an account will be harder. (Apart from the swf method if it's still working)

 

Your first point is good, but we are here for talking about "ideas", no need to being rude, i suggested only something if it needs more security. (But i'm not for this idea)

And of course yes they are going to steal ONLY xats/days/powers.

 

The idea should be like "events" & "events" : A part of transfers/trade history, and a second part of the statistics but i like your second point.

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There's really no reason this shouldn't be added... as Stah has pointed out, it doesn't help people get into other peoples accounts at all since you need to be in the account in the first place to access the log.

 

I also agree with Techy, things that seem to be simple always seem to be made unnecessarily complicated. You can still ask about this stuff on tickets, it doesn't prohibit that.

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Just now, SlOom said:

A part of transfers/trade history, and a second part of the statistics.

This doesn't need to be made into a power or a big thing at all. Users can access their log via a page and if they know how to utilize the data and make some statistics (someone can make a tool for them if that want to) then they can do so, if they don't know how to utilize or don't want to use the tool then the information still has value in knowing what you've traded and transferred over the time you've been on xat.

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Well, as i can see on this thread, there are 2 teams, vols vs users.

 

Volunteers (i mean ticket vols m8) don't want it cause it will remove 2 of their basics questions.

 

Users want it cause it will help them to see their trades/transfers and (why not its a good idea) make stats.

 

I'm sure @Vols, you can find others questions to ask. And the stats system can also help xat economy, people will want to make more profits, it will help traders.

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