Advanced Members Popular Post Christina Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Popular Post Share Posted October 17, 2017 Do you feel titles are needed on a forum on xat. Or are some just over the top? I feel titles like "retired volunteer" is not needed unless you give it to all who volunteered their time in helping xat, regardless of the circumstances. I find it personally unfair because I see some people listed before it was discussed and everyone's business, that were forced out, have it. Who is to say that someone who was volunteer for 3 months and quit, because they could not handle the situation, deserves title over someone who helped 10 years. Who is to say that an argument with Admins, that resulted in a volunteer quiting, does NOT deserve said rank. The title also allows it easier to scam or phish users by impersonation. Users may think they are being helped by a retired volunteer. i see it done plenty. I have users message me direct to report that a user trys to scam, as me even. It hurts the community. I think the title clearly does more harm then good and should not be there. Retired volunteers truly do not care of rank, unless its only based on principal. My personal opinion is that each of us who truly cared for xat, would rather keep the community safe, not use it as a tool for popularity, and just see it abolished. I also feel the vote system is flawed. I personally do not like it. I can sit there reading a post and be able to tell you who the first 3 people to like it will be. I see it as a system of points you acquire from your friends. Its really never about the topic at hand much. I know some of you may disagree. But at least state good reason. 8 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Popular Post Daniel Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Popular Post Share Posted October 17, 2017 Are you seriously this salty? Who knew you’d be able to beat a dead horse for this long. First you claimed to be thrown out and it was an inside job where everyone conspired against you and then post emails from admins on your blog and cause a huge fuss... Now you had an oh so silly little argument and quit and nothing more? What? If the title is as unnecessary as you seem to believe, why do you care so much? As for the first person to like this post, I’m sure we don’t need 3 guesses. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Leandro Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 1 hour ago, Christina said: I also feel the vote system is flawed. I personally do not like it. I can sit there reading a post and be able to tell you who the first 3 people to like it will be. I see it as a system of points you acquire from your friends. Its really never about the topic at hand much. i agree sometimes with the part ''i see it as a system of points you acquire from your friends'' but not always. With the vote system, many people, every time they suggest something or post something that IS HELPFUL to xat or the forum, can see that people are taking their suggestions serious and that can be helpful to xat. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bot Service Providers Nezhit Posted October 17, 2017 Bot Service Providers Share Posted October 17, 2017 5 minutes ago, Adeis said: i agree sometimes with the part ''i see it as a system of points you acquire from your friends'' but not always. With the vote system, many people, every time they suggest something or post something that IS HELPFUL to xat or the forum, can see that people are taking their suggestions serious and that can be helpful to xat. We both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Popular Post Chelly Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Popular Post Share Posted October 17, 2017 Feel free to remove the title because the only benefit it offers is the lovely colour that comes with it. Let me make this clear, the titles are practically worthless. A title doesn't represent the hard work that someone has done, it's just there for show. We know you've worked hard, we know you were volunteer and we know you cared about the site. Do you really need a title that badly? A title isn't going to make you feel any better about the situation. 10 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Paul Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 I actually agree, why should someone whos been a volunteer for a few months then resign deserve the title for it? retired volunteer doesn't exactly state if the user has been good or bad, no matter the circumstances anyone that was volunteer for over a certain time should be given the title 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Christina Posted October 17, 2017 Author Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 I think that some of you are missing the point. The bigger picture is that it is being used as a way to impersonate and scam. Its worthless...just as you said Chelly. I do not want this personal, about me. Even though, I knew it would be. My example of the above volunteer, was not even me. No one has been a volunteer for 10 years for one, to make that clear. I also still help users without crying rank on any chat. It's just what I do. If anyone were to give such a title, it should be admins alone. Not users who do not know stories behind every volunteers decision to leave. Not a system that clearly uses cliques to promote. Anyone who truly cares about helping xat, does not care title. Lets also not forget how hard a few volunteers fought to keep an anonymous ticket system and the reasons behind it. These titles are going against everything they stood for. If you guys want to rip me apart and say I am salty..go for it. But I know I am right out of principal. You should all think of the greater good of xat and the users, focus on that, instead. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members iNoe Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 You can´t always establish equality among all, I think there are more serious problems in xat than to devote time to this 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Popular Post Dann Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Popular Post Share Posted October 17, 2017 I think too much is being made of these titles and rep points. A volunteer is someone who dedicates their time in exchange for nothing. A title was just attached to those users that work with admins in the ticket system. But Anyone can volunteer their time in exchange for nothing without having a title or need for one. I personally see many people who volunteer their time and really want nothing in return. This is how it should be. Titles, rep points, and how people view you should mean nothing if you are truly out to help benefit xat. All volunteering work is important wether it's suggesting a new power, to managing a chat for xat, to reporting a bug or malicious users. And as chelly mentioned if you are assisting xat you will get your due recognition. I am sure we are all aware of the hard work and years volunteers have dedicated regardless of a title or NO title. I think more focus needs to be put on assisting xat than worrying about things of lesser importance (like forum titles and rep points). Even without a title you can still help around (: 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Popular Post Andre Posted October 17, 2017 Administrators Popular Post Share Posted October 17, 2017 11 hours ago, Christina said: The title also allows it easier to scam or phish users by impersonation. Users may think they are being helped by a retired volunteer. i see it done plenty. I have users message me direct to report that a user trys to scam, as me even. It hurts the community. Have you reported such abuse? I find it interesting you mentioned you've seen "it done plenty", which would suggest that several retired volunteers have tried to scam/phish users. The title is supposed to represent those who have quit on good terms, so I highly doubt there's any truth behind such accusations. If, however, I'm being unfair to assume good faith on our fellow old timers, then please report it ASAP. (I might, of course, have misunderstood you completely and you're describing those who don't have the title, but claim to be retired anyway. It's beyond me how getting rid of this title would make a difference in that case). If abolishing the honorific title will stop the unnecessary drama, nagging and especially to satisfy certain people's envy, I'm all for it. 1 hour ago, Dann said: I think more focus needs to be put on assisting xat than worrying about things of lesser importance (like forum titles and rep points). Even without a title you can still help around (: I agree completely. There are so many things wrong with this site and we're focusing on these non-issues. 21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members LaFleur Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 Don't see any issue with such title, as long as the volunteer left on good terms. It doesn't matter how long this user has been a vol. in my eyes. I also doubt how this would facilitate scam or phishing, it's not different than any other title, and if something like that would happen still, you could report it just like you would do for anything else. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Odin Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 I imagine that in short about the roles that the position receives are correct, there are risks to be taken into account however all those who have achieved such a success have been successful in fulfilling their functions within the forum and there is no plausible reason to stop having this merit recognized within it. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members ider Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 Retired Vols Title are simple and normal users so MEMBERS... 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Solange Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 I don't think that there's a risk on being scammed just because someone have the title of "Retired Volunteer". Anyway, there are always people who are impersonating Volunteers, Wiki staff, Chat managers, etc... so, there's always a "risk" on being scammed(not only because someone have this title). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members TinkerDoodle Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 5 hours ago, LaFleur said: Don't see any issue with such title, as long as the volunteer left on good terms. It doesn't matter how long this user has been a vol. in my eyes Then they should change it back to Emeritus because @Brandon would have a stronger reason as to why he refuses to give those who deserve the title lol. You wouldn't like it if someone discredits all the work you put into something for 8+ years. But I agree this subject is dead. No matter how much you try to debate with logic and sense it doesn't work. Imo we should discuss how to adv the forum so more people know about it, especially since we now know the admins/smiley makers actually do take our suggestions. I can imagine there are so many unique power suggestions but people don't know where to post them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Brandon Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 The title is temporarily "Retired Volunteer," but the meaning of emeritus is still applied; in other words, only people who left on good terms are eligible to receive it. The title will either be renamed or will be removed completely in the near future. I did not decide (nor do I decide) who gets the title. The criteria for the title was decided by all contributors. If a former volunteer doesn't have the title, it's most likely the case that they left on bad terms. In cases like this, the number of years of service is irrelevant. What has been happening recently is that only a very small subset of people have been complaining about the existence of the title and have created all the drama surrounding it. Such arguments against the title are made under the guise that the title is unimportant, but the existence of the drama stands to show that the title actually is important and that it is desired. Who knew such a simple, well-meaning thing would be turned into such an issue? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Skatel Posted October 17, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 17, 2017 because I think it's good that the volunteers who did their work here in xat to be deserving of that title Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Christina Posted October 18, 2017 Author Advanced Members Share Posted October 18, 2017 36 minutes ago, Brandon said: The title is temporarily "Retired Volunteer," but the meaning of emeritus is still applied; in other words, only people who left on good terms are eligible to receive it. The title will either be renamed or will be removed completely in the near future. I did not decide (nor do I decide) who gets the title. The criteria for the title was decided by all contributors. If a former volunteer doesn't have the title, it's most likely the case that they left on bad terms. In cases like this, the number of years of service is irrelevant. What has been happening recently is that only a very small subset of people have been complaining about the existence of the title and have created all the drama surrounding it. Such arguments against the title are made under the guise that the title is unimportant, but the existence of the drama stands to show that the title actually is important and that it is desired. Who knew such a simple, well-meaning thing would be turned into such an issue? Actually Brandon..having these titles goes against what the past volunteers that you claim to admire stood for. They fought hard to get the ticket system anonymous. They fought hard to keep contributors anonymous. It is only important to a little clique who needs the rank. I can also state at least 3 current volunteers were "relieved of duties" in past. Will you choose to deny them as well? My argument on this still stands. Not you offering contributors a generic thread to vote, without knowing facts on each volunteer. Personally, it became principal for me with changing the "title" and others wanting to add things like chat owners, etc. Its downright dumb. Abolish the titles, period. They aren't needed. People are using it as a means to try and phish. And I know you see it every day. So you can continue to choose to ignore it and deny. But we both know the truth. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Brandon Posted October 18, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 18, 2017 57 minutes ago, Christina said: Actually Brandon..having these titles goes against what the past volunteers that you claim to admire stood for. They fought hard to get the ticket system anonymous. This argument is not consistent. Those volunteers argued for anonymous names on tickets, not total anonymity across the website. They were recognized as volunteers on the forum and on the wiki, so that argument doesn't really stand well. 1 hour ago, Christina said: I can also state at least 3 current volunteers were "relieved of duties" in past. Will you choose to deny them as well? We can answer this by using the criteria that is in place: Could the ex-volunteer in question be welcomed back as a volunteer again? Since the people you're referring to were relieved of their duties and then were allowed back on the team, the answer is no, they wouldn't be denied. 1 hour ago, Christina said: Not you offering contributors a generic thread to vote, without knowing facts on each volunteer. Instead of voting on a particular ex-volunteer, we used the opportunity to setup a criteria for all ex-volunteers. The same set of questions are asked for each person who is being considered for the title. Therefore, the specific facts are not always important, since the answer can be found without knowing all of the ex-volunteer's history. 1 hour ago, Christina said: Personally, it became principal for me with changing the "title" and others wanting to add things like chat owners, etc. Its downright dumb. Abolish the titles, period. They aren't needed. We didn't intend for the meaning to change for the title. In fact, the meaning was meant to stay the same. The reason for the renaming was to make it more simplistic: People would no longer need to ask what emeritus meant. However, the unintended consequence is that people think it now has a different meaning. I agree with your other statements. We don't need a title for chat owners, for example. They can create a club themselves, so a user group is not needed, as they would not have a private forum other than the one in their club. However, the only title that is truly not needed is "Retired Volunteer." For this reason, it's being considered for removal. The rest of the titles are not dumb and are necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Christina Posted October 18, 2017 Author Advanced Members Share Posted October 18, 2017 15 minutes ago, Brandon said: Instead of voting on a particular ex-volunteer, we used the opportunity to setup a criteria for all ex-volunteers. The same set of questions are asked for each person who is being considered for the title. Therefore, the specific facts are not always important, since the answer can be found without knowing all of the ex-volunteer's history. Actually i could debunk this whole false criteria, easily. There are things only old volunteers and Admins would know. I see honor given to some that were "removed", for example. However...my goal is NOT to take away from anyone, or single anyone out. Also you were not privileged to the discussions to state the anonymity given met only certain areas, while not others. These titles came only after your service, perhaps shortly before. I can also give you a list of classified volunteers who were NEVER listed on wiki, again is not my goal. I only answer to what you state or claim that I know to be false and untrue. Hense the whole I do not feel it is YOUR right or any of the contributors right to decide who gets what. Only Admins should have that call. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Rida Posted October 18, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 18, 2017 The word retired (emeritus) means retired, not kicked out. This thread sounds more personal more than anything. Most points you've stated against it don't even make sense. You said people use this to impersonate, phish and scam. First of all, has this been reported at all? Secondly, scammers attempt to impersonate volunteers all the time, retired or not retired. You also stated they impersonate as you and you don't even have the title. So how would removing the title stop anything if you don't even have the title? So going by what you said in the same argument, phishing and scamming would take place regardless of having the title or no title. Your other argument of volunteers fighting to keep the ticket system anonymous also makes absolutely zero sense. They were not anonymous on the forum or even the wiki. The reason they kept that anonymity was to avoid being harassed due to ticket replies. Counter arguing that point with "not being priveleged to the discussion" shows you've lost that one. And for the record, volunteers who were not listed anywhere was done by personal choice, the same goes for this forum title. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Harrison Posted October 18, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 18, 2017 14 minutes ago, Christina said: Only Admins should have that call. Admins are focused on more important things than titles, which is why it was delegated to the Contributors to decide criteria. Seems this debate keeps popping up every three months when the community should be focused on more important things! It doesn't "help the users" to keep debating this silly question. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Popular Post Steven Posted October 18, 2017 Advanced Members Popular Post Share Posted October 18, 2017 I don’t think any of us with the title care too much about it, but I now hope it stays just because removing it now to cater to people who are still bitter about who has/doesn’t have it would be weak. This is such a non-issue, I can’t believe there is a legitimate discussion about it. (Actually, I totally can believe it, which is sad). 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Shake Posted October 18, 2017 Advanced Members Share Posted October 18, 2017 26 minutes ago, Phin said: Why does a rank on a virtual website even matter? It's not like you're being crowned Queen of England or anything. Oh boy. We all wish it were that easy... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Members Christina Posted October 18, 2017 Author Advanced Members Share Posted October 18, 2017 I guess for me despite the safety issues and too address solely what most here have focused on... The title is a disgrace. One made up to honor those you choose. You have failed to honor the original volunteers before there was title listed on wiki. You have failed in giving someone title who was not a ticket volunteer, despite stating the honor is for those. You have failed at learning the history of the volunteering community and by classifying certain individuals who would not deserve based on the "standards" presented, while discrediting others. Congrats! It really is just some pretty colored letters on a forum that has 0 merit. I hope that I have enlightened some and educated others. Keep the title so as not to cater to those who may be bitter or weak as Steven suggested, if it makes you happy. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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