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XAT - IT'S TIME FOR A CHANGE


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20 minutes ago, Bau said:

I noticed that before it was little talk and much was done.
Now there is much talk and little is done.
How long should we continue to talk without making changes?
I have a year since I left, and anyway there were no changes.
Five or more years ago was good, the united world, and they were listening to each other, now they all argue without any reason.
It's upset, after saying that we're all bad.

I do not want to be right, but unfortunately this is the reality now on xat.com.
If I'm wrong, I'm sorry......:):(
I want to cry, :'( not cry because I still love xat.com, that's why I'm here every day....:$
@Admin
Edit: You can change anything but @muffins , it always remains.
LOL :$ 

 

yes bau i agree lol

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Hello Xat Users!   I'm writing this post today because I would like to bring up the discussion of XAT potentially dying. I would like to make it clear that I am in no way trying to put down

If there is anything in this thread that volunteers don't think should be here, then instead of deleting the entire thread please go through and deleted the selected parts. Thanks <£   I

An unproductive reply to a thread that has highlighted many issues.   However, I don't think the lack of faith is anyones issue other than your own. The fact you've allowed these issues to a

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3 hours ago, Madison said:

I just think that xat needs to be more careful about who they're making volunteers in the first place- this being people who take their time, actually show a passion for xat, and aren't getting their ranks just because they know the right people at the right time. I could name so many people who aren't volunteers who definitely deserve to be.

 

3 hours ago, Madison said:

There are really only a couple options in regards to the ticket situation.

 

1. Start letting more <trustworthy> people help answer tickets.

2. Take more time to decide who truly does deserve to be a volunteer.

This may come across a little harsh but I'm going to say it anyway, and no, I'm not defending myself, as I am no longer a volunteer (my forum title is misleading)...

 

Every single volunteer on the list right now fits the criteria you've laid out. Everyone on the list deserves the position because they've worked hard on xat over the years and have shown dedication and passion. Nobody simply has their position because they "know someone," and I don't really know how you can make that claim.

 

Also, I understand it is easy for people who don't know what goes into the decisions of who to "hire" to criticize the choices and declare that there are "so many" better options, but frankly, you're wrong. It's easy to sit back and look at the list of people passionate on this forum and say "they'd be a good volunteer, they'd be a good volunteer too," but the reality is that the people selected need to fit under a lot more criteria than just being "trustworthy" (which is an incredibly vague word) or "passionate." There aren't as many candidates as you may think, and some of the candidates you're probably thinking of could be on the radar of admins/volunteers already, but timing is important too.

 

And yes, volunteers "need" time to chat as well, but also they have lives. The truth is that xat is not the #1 priority of any volunteer. Life gets in the way, and everyone has things that they're going to put before answering tickets. Not putting in as much work as some others do shouldn't be seen as them not being "willing" to put in work, but rather, them being unable to put in the work because of their personal lives. Now I do believe if they become too busy (like me) and they hit points where they can't see themselves having more ticket time in the future, stepping down is the right thing to do, but I also understand why some sometimes don't. Unpaid volunteers running the entire support system for a website as complicated as xat is never going to be flawless.

 

I won't comment on the other issues brought up here because they're being analyzed heavily already and I have nothing new to add.

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47 minutes ago, Steven said:

Nobody simply has their position because they "know someone," and I don't really know how you can make that claim.

This also happens w/ contributors, you know, so we know the reason that he said this.

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10 minutes ago, Laming said:

This also happens w/ contributors, you know, so we know the reason that he said this.

Contributors =! volunteers.

 

This also brings up another point that some of the people criticizing the volunteers and contributors in this thread are just mad that they haven't been allowed into these groups. I won't go into more detail, but I will say it's painfully obvious in some cases. I appreciate the people who genuinely don't care about their own "ranks" and are giving their true, unbiased opinions (Karl, Flake, etc.) and I hope the sincere voices in this thread are heard.

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1 hour ago, Steven said:

Nobody simply has their position because they "know someone," and I don't really know how you can make that claim.

I'm going to highlight "simply". Because you do need to know about xat... I agree. BUT there are far more people that deserve it over others. And vols really come in because of who they know. It's just reality. And I'm not trying to bash it. But I really don't know how you don't see it and how you don't understand how people make that claim. You know how the system for picking new vols works, just as much as us. 

 

AGAIN - not picking a side here - BUT it makes no sense to ignore the obvious either.

 

@Steven

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10 minutes ago, dann said:

I'm going to highlight "simply". Because you do need to know about xat... I agree. BUT there are far more people that deserve it over others. And vols really come in because of who they know. It's just reality. And I'm not trying to bash it. But I really don't know how you don't see it and how you don't understand how people make that claim. You know how the system for picking new vols works, just as much as us. 

 

 

@Steven

 

I'd have to agree, and this is the only point I disagree with on Steven's post. There will always be some influence from people they know in deciding whether they become a volunteer. It's inevitable. As an example, a short amount of time after you got Volunteer, Chelly did. Not to bash either one of you, I think you are both good, but it's unlikely that this happened due to pure chance. I could name other cases but I think it's pointless.

 

So you get what I'm saying more, it's like saying "the environment doesn't affect whether someone will commit crimes, only genetics do". That's clearly a false statement, there is bound to be some influence from the environment, but it is impossible to measure the extent to which these environmental factors will contribute to whether someone will commit crimes or not.

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I guess I worded it badly. What I'm saying is that nobody is picked purely because they know someone. Of course most volunteers picked would need to know some others, otherwise there would be no way for the current volunteers to trust the incoming ones. But a common misconception is that volunteers are made over other potential candidates because they have better personal relationships with the current ones, which isn't true. They may be brought up in discussion because current ones know of their work ethic and dedication, but they're not selected just for knowing someone.

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1 minute ago, Steven said:

I guess I worded it badly. What I'm saying is that nobody is picked purely because they know someone. Of course most volunteers picked would need to know some others, otherwise there would be no way for the current volunteers to trust the incoming ones. But a common misconception is that volunteers are made over other potential candidates because they have better personal relationships with the current ones, which isn't true. They may be brought up in discussion because current ones know of their work ethic and dedication, but they're not selected just for knowing someone.

 

This I would agree with

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Ugg!  Truth has always been if you are not known or liked by volunteers...then you have little chance.  It does not matter what you are capable of.

Honestly...I would be a hypocrite to say I haven't disagreed with some becoming volunteer or opposed others.  Often times it was due to mistrust and I DO KNOW

that I have a hard time of letting go of some peoples past mistakes and just trusting anyone.  I also had a sense of they just were not good enough..always wanting the best for xat.

I think this is where people get the "its who you know attitude from."  That feeling or vibe. Just explaining it from another pesrpective.

 

My issue is not how volunteers are chosen.  Ones I thought would amaze me...have disappointed. Ones I felt would amount to nothing..are sometimes the ones who really care.

I do not think changing the current volunteer structure and process is the problem and will fix xat. I do feel they should have accountability though.  

 

I don't care for your comment that people are mad because they aren't volunteer.  Not everyone can be. Also most I see posting here...would not even want it.  Steven..I know you.

I also know that comment was not intended how it sounded.  However....it gives me the vibe that I am volunteer and above all attitude though.  Like I said..I know it was not your intention.

I believe you are 1 that went in hoping to change xat and make it better.  My reference to this is not to single you out but to answer and shed to light to several pcs that I received about it.

Just putting it out there in the open.

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1 minute ago, TinkerDoodle said:

discussing pretty important matters

It is not people's business to argue how people get picked to become contributor , volunteer or how they get ranked. This thread went from what would be good to make some changes to why some people get rank and some others don't

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I think my comment was misunderstood, most people here are commenting out of genuine concern and that's good.

 

Moving on from the ranks thing... I personally believe the tickets are part of the problem, but not the main reason people leave (and not the main reason new people don't join). I think the move to HTML5 will be important and I hope it isn't too far into the future. But still, I agree with someone (forget who, may have been Tina) who said that xat used to draw in users because it was paired with radios or with games. Since it no longer has that purpose, I feel like the only way it's going to gain a lot of new users is if it somehow finds a way to reestablish itself as a useful and different tool. Like some pointed out, platforms like Discord are now better for gaming, so xat has to do something different to make it stand out. Unfortunately I really don't have any ideas there :$

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17 minutes ago, Mario said:

It is not people's business to argue how people get picked to become contributor , volunteer or how they get ranked. This thread went from what would be good to make some changes to why some people get rank and some others don't

Im not gonna bother replying then that'll be drama and I don't want this wonderful thread to be locked. You can find me @xat5 or /f1431143 and we can talk about it in pc. 

 

 

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I'm glad a lot of people care and are voicing their opinions in this thread. But for real, does all of this even matter? Xat chooses what they do and do not listen to from users. We see a bit of improvements with the "To Do List" thread, but it seems like it's literal baby steps whenever they do fix something that has been suggested on that thread. And I think mobile was actually more of a handicap than it actually helped. The website should have just as much as priority as mobile and at this point is inexcusable. Wake up, xat is dying because it hasn't changed. Minor detail changes to chat buttons and pawn fixes aren't going to put people in awe.

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7 minutes ago, Phinny said:

That's the whole reason this site is dying. Nobody advertised for xat, and nobody fixed the bugs and glitches. They stopped caring, otherwise xat wouldn't be so dead today.

agreed

 

this is the truth

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12 hours ago, Mencee said:

Wake up, xat is dying because it hasn't changed. Minor detail changes to chat buttons and pawn fixes aren't going to put people in awe.

We're not only talking about "minor detail changes to chat buttons and pawn fixes" in this thread, which you would have seen if you cared to read it all, or even a portion, honestly. We are, however, talking about mostly everything else you said, "it hasn't changed", or more so...

12 hours ago, Mencee said:

Xat chooses what they do and do not listen to from users

 

Yes, it does matter, which is why we are voicing our opinions on the matter. Yes, it's their company, but without the users, there wouldn't be one.

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This probably isn't what everyone wants to hear, and it is unfortunate that Xat has dropped to this state, as it used to be my chat system of choice back during 2008, but there came a point where I couldn't stick with what is a fairly antiquated site.

 

To be honest, Xat missed it's chance five years ago. Discord is basically what I and quite a few people have always wanted, but which we didn't have the resources to realise.

I have seen many sites switch over to Discord, from Chatango and other similar services.

 

To compete with Discord, Xat would basically have to get rid of powers. All of them. Discord lets you upload your own emojis to your "servers" aka a guild which can hold multiple chats called "channels". Any user can make a server. For free.

 

That feature alone blows most of the micro-transactions Xat has out of the water, as you no longer need to pay for new smilies, you can simply upload some, and this gives you the flexibility of using whatever you want.

 

Discord's premium service, Nitro lets you use emojis from any server you're in anywhere. Some special servers, those run by partners, or even discord staff may even have emojis you can use globally simply by joining them. You don't even need Nitro to use them!

 

Discord has much, much fewer distractions. There aren't micro-transactions which give you fancy colours or purple pawns before your name in the user list. Things are customised as the chat owner sees fit.

They can create custom roles with whatever permissions they wish, have whatever colours they want for those roles. whatever order they please, and set user nicknames for that server to whatever they please.

 

Discord has no concept of "main owners" which can be granted to multiple users. There is simply an owner who is always the owner of the chat, unless they transfer ownership. While this seems less flexible, this is actually a step forward, as I have seen many, many problems with main owners on Xat before.

 

Discord has a modern theme on mobile, native, and the web. Xat's chats look like something out of 2007, and the main site's theme looks like something out of the 90s.

Discord is growing rapidly, and I can only see it going up and up. This is because Discord doesn't pursue short-term gains, but the big picture.

 

And honestly, it's too late for Xat to compete with Discord. Even if it made a move, it would be seen as little more than a copy-cat, assuming that Xat has the time and resources to make a move.

 

Discord is also in constant development. New features are constantly being released. For free. The current ones they're working on are audit logs and screen-sharing. Audit logs being something you have to pay for on Xat, and last I checked, the theme for it was horrendous.

 

There were also things like kisses in Xat which are extremely distracting. This isn't possible at all in Discord, and it's actually a *good thing*. Discord's staff are also extremely responsive to the community, in fact I have had the pleasure of meeting one myself. Xat's admins are like unicorns in comparison.

 

I don't know if Xat can survive, but I sincerely doubt it. It would take a really big move, and a mountain of luck for Xat to manoeuvre itself out of this rut. But, who knows. Anything's possible.

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@Azareal No offence, but if your you're that much into discord, you should probably go use discord then without looking back.

 

I don't want xat to become like discord and i don't want to upload my own smilies, because xat makes the best smilies of all. Uniqueness!

 

All people want to see is that admins start listening to the community; that bugs get fixed, that suggestions are used, that we get new (free) features and some innovation, a html5 chat version and that ticket delays get reduced, as much as possible.

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36 minutes ago, LaFleur said:

@Azareal No offence, but if your you're that much into discord, you should probably go use discord then without looking back.

 

I don't want xat to become like discord and i don't want to upload my own smilies, because xat makes the best smilies of all. Uniqueness!

 

All people want to see is that admins start listening to the community; that bugs get fixed, that suggestions are used, that we get new (free) features and some innovation, a html5 chat version and that ticket delays get reduced, as much as possible.

 

I'm not going to respond to the rest of that, as my post speaks for itself, but there are many, many emoji servers on Discord with really nice emojis aka smilies. They're in no way inferior to Xat's premium smilies.

 

If Xat wants to make a comeback, then they naturally need to understand exactly what they've done wrong, and why Discord is gaining so many users in comparison to them.

No need to be so defensive. When you start being defensive, it actually weakens your position.

 

And as I said at the end, it take a great deal of time, resources, and luck. Not only that, but some big sacrifices will have to be made. But that is life, without risk, there is no gain.

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1 minute ago, Azareal said:

 

I'm not going to respond to the rest of that, as my post speaks for itself, but there are many, many emoji servers on Discord with really nice emojis aka smilies. They're in no way inferior to Xat's premium smilies.

 

If Xat wants to make a comeback, then they naturally need to understand exactly what they've done wrong, and why Discord is gaining so many users in comparison to them.

No need to be so defensive. When you start being defensive, it actually weakens your position.

 

And as I said at the end, it take a great deal of time, resources, and luck. Not only that, but some big sacrifices will have to be made. But that is life, without risk, there is no gain.

I want to make a quick point. Why do you think xat needs to be compared to Discord? Why do you feel that xat needs to do what they have done? Each chat system is unique to its own thing. And In my opinion xat just needs to work on their core and stick to their user base.

 

Discord is good for gamers and what not... GOOD for them. That does not mean xat has to follow the same path... 

 

They just need to make sure the core principles of running a business are met. It's just that simple. Each place has a different target audience. Xat doesn't have to go specifically for gamers, they can decide to go about it whatever way they please. As long as they generate a user base. SO you are not really comparing apples to apples here. And I must say, therefore, making your point invalid.

 

NOW, with that being said. The point of this thread is exactly as LaFleur Put it:

49 minutes ago, LaFleur said:

All people want to see is that admins start listening to the community; that bugs get fixed, that suggestions are used, that we get new (free) features and some innovation, a html5 chat version and that ticket delays get reduced, as much as possible.

 

I don't personally like Discord, And WOULD NOT use it. So I don't think xat should look into being like anyone else. They would no longer be Xat if that's the case. Xat just needs to follow the principles stated above and it will attract its own user base. They need to stay on top of things and listen to the users. THEIR users.. not discords... or any other chat service. Xat should start by fixing up the support system. So that users can come back on and get their accounts reactivated, etc etc.

 

-Dann 

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3 hours ago, oj said:

We're not only talking about "minor detail changes to chat buttons and pawn fixes" in this thread, which you would have seen if you cared to read it all, or even a portion, honestly. We are, however, talking about mostly everything else you said, "it hasn't changed", or more so...

 

Yes, it does matter, which is why we are voicing our opinions on the matter. Yes, it's their company, but without the users, there wouldn't be one.

 

I think you took what I said and twisted it because my post is exactly what you are implying. I'm saying minor changes to the website won't keep users (such as the ones I mentioned) 

 

??? @ your 2nd response. Why are you acting like I don't know people are saying their thoughts? That was the first thing I said in my post. I'm saying even with everyone voicing their thoughts, will it make the difference? Probably not, admins already provided proof they don't care as much as we'd hope them to. 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, dann said:

I want to make a quick point. Why do you think xat needs to be compared to Discord?

 

Because discord is a successful platform, and xat is not. Comparing to something that is successful allows us to see what xat does wrong, and what discord is doing right. Powers are unique, sure, but so is the ability to use almost any smiley or whatever they're called on discord, and create custom ones yourself for your own server. It gives endless possibilities that the USER wants. Already, the only thing that really makes xat "unique" is beat by discord. Discord has xat beat in pretty much every other area, so unless there is a dramatic change, I agree that xat will die relatively quickly.

 

Sure, YOU might not like discord, but the majority of people would disagree with that statement.

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