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Lemona

Is the downvote really necessary in the General Support forum?

LaFleur

The downvote has been removed from General Support.

Message added by LaFleur

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3 minutes ago, Daniel said:

This is false. good day.

How do you suppose they recover it?

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55 minutes ago, Steven said:

I'll ask again: is deleting posts that do this a more acceptable way of handling it? NO

Is discouraging some users to help an acceptable way as well? Is down voting someone's answer because their English isn't the best acceptable? Are we really gonna make people feel bad for trying to help?

 

"Get help from the community!" I don't exactly see a problem with 3 answers that may or may not be the same if the help provided is decent enough, especially if their isn't too too much of a time difference. Helping others should be a community effort. The accepted answer should be the answer that answers the question(s) correctly and I guess whoever posted that first (so here comes the competition factor). But to see other answers that aren't exactly wrong be downvoted just because they didn't post first or because someone dislikes them or they forgot to link something would be sad. I really didn't see a problem with just the up vote (besides the fact that apparently you get PC's about it... it's not up to them anyway??). All in all, it's kind of always been some sort of competition and bringing this down vote button back is just worsening the problem.  If a user is posting false information, it should be discussed privately with them so they know for next time to help themselves improve. As Kyle mentioned, seeing -3 and -4 answers is really not pleasing to see and I'm sure the user asking the question wouldn't really like to see that either. It is nice to see other users help out and even if they are lacking some knowledge, they don't deserve to feel that their answer will be downvoted or not liked from the community. 

 

Can we please just keep it the way it was? If a user is giving false information, it should be up to a volunteer to either discuss with the user privately or to simply hide the post for them (with explanation). Otherwise, the "top answer" will be the answer that the volunteer has decided to choose that they felt best answers the question. If a user isn't happy with the top answer, it really wasn't their decision and it's honestly not a big deal. Adding the same information that  was already there really isn't a big deal either.... the top answer will probably be the one that's already there and was answered fully first no?

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Don't think it's a detail that should matter nevertheless if it has a purpose of not.

Useless or not a downvote button doesn't harm anyone and doesn't make the forums less enjoyable, imo.

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10 hours ago, Jedi said:

Instead of downvoted users who tried to help users, you can maybe educate them?

 

You can't be the best helper the first day you are trying to help users.

 

Downvote button is the wrong way to go, if you are telling new helpers they are bad, they won't help anymore. that's not good.

 

And it's YOUR JOB, to senior helpers to help newbies to send the good answer.

 

yh so they can look at the answers that have been upvoted to find the answer teehee lol

 

if people are downvoted then they're probably doing something wrong, so they can look at the most upvoted answers to find the correct solution, making them more able to answer similar questions in the future

 

i agree that a system is required to stop unnecessary or misinformed posts, but the fact that people are getting mad over being downvoted in itself is the reason why the downvote system is currently bad, if people didnt care the system wouldnt be bad at all in my opinion

 

the likely solution is for people to either A. give time for people to realise their post is getting downvoted for a reason (99.9% chance their post is unnecessary or provides misinformation) or B. have a volunteer delete all posts that provide unnecessary/misinformed information instead of a downvote system

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3 minutes ago, Gone said:

Don't think it's a detail that should matter nevertheless if it has a purpose of not.

Useless or not a downvote button doesn't harm anyone and doesn't make the forums less enjoyable, imo.

Exactly, but apparently it harms a lot of people, when they can't accept that their answer got downvoted, or not even marked as best.

 

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15 hours ago, Lemona said:

What are your thoughts? 

Already I have no thoughts.



Now....

just to be fair, anyone can vote negatively, down
I do not think is necessary.
Comment deleted, as said @Lemona "is better.
Who hates you vote below, it is not necessary to have the right answer or not. This is so wrong.



Editing message. ´´comment´´
Thanks, and have a nice evening. ´´Good Night´´

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7 minutes ago, Bau said:

Who hates you vote below, it is not necessary to have the right answer or not. This is so wrong.

It is OBVIOUS the answer has to be right, otherwise you would get downvoted. It's not rocket science.

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To begin, because we haven't been given an explanation of how we should be using the voting system and hence why all this mess came-about. My set of rules would be, if you think the content contributes to the conversation or subject of the thread, upvote it. If you think it does not contribute to the thread in anyway or is off-topic, downvote it.

 

This thread has dwindled into a chaotic mess, from a general discussion to pin-pointing what users did wrong. Take a step back and look at it as a whole, the section "General Supports" is for the community to help, it should be a section for people willing and wanting to help.

 

Now what were to happen if you downvoted users who want to help, but might not have full knowledge on the subject, they wouldn't want to post again, and I don't know about you, but this isn't where we should be striving to go. You need to identify users clearly trolling and giving false information from those who want to help.

 

Currently the "General Supports" section works as followed, users post answers and replies which contribute to the question or concern another user may have, then a volunteer who would be expected to know would choose the best answer (or in some cases, where they feel as if it's needed, post an answer themselves). This way the user seeking for help will already see the "best" answer, or the most correct one. Having further discussions in regards to the subject isn't a bad thing nor should it be downvoted.

 

Seems highly suspicious to me that only recently, people started getting highly upvoted and downvoted, hopefully not done in spite.

 

I don't know if it's possible, but I think downvoting should be removed, upvoting alone is fine. If someone is giving false information, they can be corrected or have their post removed entirely depending on how severe it is. But in most cases, people post correct information, just not directly to the question, which is still fine, because it contributes to the general discussion.

 

 

11 hours ago, Daniel said:

It's for separating good answers and bad answers.

It is separated at the end, hence why we have volunteers to select the best answer. Some answers may not be directly answering the questions, but it still contributes to the conversation as a whole, which is absolutely fine, it doesn't necessarily mean they are 'bad answers'.

11 hours ago, Daniel said:

I dont see what's unfair? Junior and Kyle provided correct information and answered the question and the rest did not. 

You have to understand that the section is used to provide support and help to the user, it does not necessarily mean you have to focus on answering the question alone, else be downvoted. It was obvious an answer was given already, but the other users expanded and added extra details even if they weren't directly answering the question, why downvote that? I wont go into that thread too much and keep this discussion as a whole.

10 hours ago, shake said:

Take the downvote button as a learning method. If you don't want your answers to be downvoted, learn from their mistakes and avoid making them again.

This is an absurd comment to make, what are you exactly learning through downvoting? You're being forced to conform to how users want you to answer, which just goes back to popularity. If a user gets downvoted without any explanation, how does that help anyone except discourage them from further usage of the section.

2 hours ago, Steven said:

I will try to be clear here. The moral of the story is that posting an answer that's already been posted, adding miniscule details (for example, linking to the buy page, something that I guarantee essentially everyone who knows about the forum knows about), and then complaining when you aren't marked best answer despite yours having more detail is just a waste of everyone's time. 

 

I understand people want to try to earn ranks or recognition but this is not the way to go about it and there were several people doing it more and more, so downvotes were added to combat that. 

 

I'll ask again: is deleting posts that do this a more acceptable way of handling it? 

I don't think anyone is complaining about being marked as the best answer, it's the polar opposite of being downvoted instead, even when the replies were correct in their own rights. I could argue that it's a good thing that users want to strive to earn ranks and recognition through helping people on the forum, as long as they put the effort in. As for deleting posts, not a good idea unless the reply is off-topic or in no way, contributes to the thread.

1 hour ago, Daniel said:

The accepted answer is the correct answer - learn from it.

The best answer marked may be the most correct in terms of answering the question posted by op, but it does not mean you can't post other relevant information without being downvoting.

21 minutes ago, Flake said:

if people are downvoted then they're probably doing something wrong

This would be true, if people were to be trusted to use the upvote downvote system properly and not solely based on how much you like or dislike a person, not saying this was the case, but it will most definitely happen in the future if we don't have a proper guideline on how to use the upvote/downvote system.

 

In conclusion, volunteers need to come up with an official guideline on how to use the upvote/downvote system properly, for example, what should be upvoted and what should be downvoted?  Then we should be discussing whether that guideline set in place is fair or not.

 

Wont be replying till I get off work tonight.

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7 minutes ago, Mom said:

This would be true, if people were to be trusted to use the upvote downvote system properly and not solely based on how much you like or dislike a person, not saying this was the case, but it will most definitely happen in the future if we don't have a proper guideline on how to use the upvote/downvote system.

 

In conclusion, volunteers need to come up with an official guideline on how to use the upvote/downvote system properly, for example, what should be upvoted and what should be downvoted?  Then we should be discussing whether that guideline set in place is fair or not.

 

it's possible that people could get downvoted because they are disliked or upvoted because they are liked but i believe the majority vote will be a neutral response, negating bias votes. looking at the downvoted posts on recent threads, i can see they've been downvoted for a reason so the system seems to be fairly accurate, and im sure many would agree with me

 

why does there need to be an official guideline? it's not hard to see if a post is irrelevant/has unnecessary information, is almost exactly the same as someone else who posted previously or if they are giving misinformation (or a mix of the above).

 

i cant be bothered 2 read what other stuff u put because i would rather not read the bible lol

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4 minutes ago, shake said:

It is OBVIOUS the answer has to be right, otherwise you would get downvoted. It's not rocket science.

get someone new who does not know anything forum
vote down even if the answer is correct
because he does not know, or someone is playing. 
I understand, and all understand, but maybe someone can vote down, make a joke. anyone can vote down.

This option should only be for volunteers, or remove the comments.
This is just an opinion you should not be nervous. (hippo)

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Just now, Bau said:

get someone new who does not know anything forum
vote down even if the answer is correct
because he does not know, or someone is playing. 
I understand, and all understand, but maybe someone can vote down, make a joke. anyone can vote down.

This option should only be for volunteers, or remove the comments.
This is just an opinion you should not be nervous. (hippo)

 

if it was only for volunteers there would be approximately 0.1 upvotes or downvotes lol

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1 minute ago, Flake said:

 

if it was only for volunteers there would be approximately 0.1 upvotes or downvotes lol

correct. just for staff Forum.
why should these votes? okay you help its okay. but downvote hmm it makes you weaker (hippo)

Support is not playing who gets more votes for help. (smirk)

 

if wrong, you teach you not to make another mistake once.

Our volunteers edit the comments where we are wrong
like us to know where we make mistakes, or where I was wrong.

It is marked with red message, and we know what is wrong and what is true.  or cut in half.

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8 minutes ago, Bau said:

It is marked with red message, and we know what is wrong and what is true.

 

good idea

 

edit: kappa

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11 minutes ago, Bau said:

Our volunteers edit the comments where we are wrong

I don't think anyone would bother editing the comment of someone else to correct him just because the other was the first one willing to help.

Why would volunteers do it? This isn't a training place for new people willing to help...

 

I've also read a guideline would help, how is setting up a new guideline (which requires more moderation from volunteers) is easier than simply learning from facts at a users side?

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3 minutes ago, Sydno said:

I don't think anyone would bother editing the comment of someone else to correct him just because the other was the first one willing to help.

Why would volunteers do it? This isn't a training place...

 

I've also read a guideline would help, how is setting up a new guideline (which requires more moderation from volunteers) is easier than simply learning from facts?

I said only an opinion already do each what he wants, when he wants, where he wants.

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10 minutes ago, Bau said:

It is marked with red message, and we know what is wrong and what is true.  or cut in half.

that's the point of downvoting

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1 minute ago, Bau said:

I said only an opinion already do each what he wants, when he wants, where he wants.

 

yes i very much agree with you bau very good analysis

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2 minutes ago, Bau said:

I said only an opinion already do each what he wants, when he wants, where he wants.

 

 

Thanks for providing me with my new life motto 

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2 minutes ago, Flake said:

 

yes i very much agree with you bau very good analysis

Thank you.

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4 minutes ago, Karl said:

 

 

Thanks for providing me with my new life motto 

You play with me, or are you serious. :(:'(



 

 

2 minutes ago, Flake said:

ur welcome teehee

:$

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Can we stay on topic at least?

 

The volunteers probably had a discussion prior to re-adding the down vote button and decided that's what they wanted to do. Either way it's here now and we have to see where it goes from here. If it gets abused, then I can see something changing.

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